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Support => General Help & Advice => Topic started by: Degsy on June 26, 2014, 11:43:24 am

Title: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 26, 2014, 11:43:24 am
Hi Guys,
I run Peppermint 4 64 bit on an old Dell Inspiron 1640 that used to run XP and also Ubuntu 12.04 on a self build desk top. Successfully downloaded, burned and loaded the live Peppermint 5 to the laptop, decided to try Ubuntu 14.04 on the desktop, it loads and allows be to boot into the Try Ubuntu, then locks up, freezes and eventually crashes. Used the same DVD with Ubuntu 14.04 on the Peppermint laptop and this boots up fine into the live session, any suggestions anyone?
This is not critical as I can either continue with 12.04 on the desktop or maybe even run Peppermint 5 on the desktop as well.

Thanks in advance,
Degsy.
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: chemicalfan on June 26, 2014, 12:14:21 pm
What is the spec on the self build machine? What motherboard & CPU?
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 26, 2014, 12:36:23 pm
Hi Chemicalfan,
The self build has a Sempron 140 2.7GHZ processor and the Motherboard is an Asus AM3 AMD GF 7025 DDR3 mATX, it has a Samsung 160Gb HD and 2Gb Ram, hope this is helpful.
Just as an extra, I tried the Peppermint 5 Live CD in the Desk Top and this is where I am replying from now, so the Pep 5 works a treat on the self build.

Cheers,
Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: chemicalfan on June 26, 2014, 01:34:50 pm
Very odd!
At the point it locks up, do you get a response from Ctrl-Alt-F1?
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Emegra on June 26, 2014, 01:53:45 pm
Hi Degsy

it sounds to me the problem might just be that there's something about the 14.04 .iso your DVD drive on the self build doesn't like, DVD drives can be fickle things

Have you tried burning another DVD (preferably with a different make of disc) or trying it with a live USB instead ?


Good luck



Graeme
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 26, 2014, 04:18:27 pm
Just tried again and this time the screen just went blank after clicking the "Try Ubuntu" tab, tried Ctrl+Alt+F1 but no response at all, in fact to shut down had to turn off power, which obviously is not good.
Graeme, had a look and at the moment I only have the one brand of DVD, however, will buy a different brand and give that a try. The self build does not give the option to boot from USB in the menu.

Many thanks for your replies so far Gents,

Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 26, 2014, 05:30:10 pm
Quick update, tried your suggestion Graeme, using different and supposedly better quality DVD disc but same result, allowed me to get to the "Try Ubuntu" screen, then after clicking the tab the screen went black and all I got was the cursur from the mouse, but no effect for anything else.
I wonder if I try burning the disc on the laptop rather than the self build?

Thanks again for your help so far,

Degsy.
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Mark Greaves (PCNetSpec) on June 26, 2014, 06:06:45 pm
You could try using Peppermint to 'dd' the Ubuntu ISO image to a USB stick.

With a bit of luck, the BIOS will then think it's a hard drive and list it as available to boot.
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 26, 2014, 06:13:24 pm
Sorry Mark, but could you explain that a little more for me, what exactly do I do to achieve what you suggest? Have USB sticks available to give it a go.

Thanks,
Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: SeZo on June 26, 2014, 08:01:44 pm
I will try to clarify it for you.
The dd utility copies the specified input file to the specified output with possible conversions.
DD a very powerful tool. So would recommend extra care when using dd because it could cost you valuable data if you get it wrong.
The general syntax is:
dd if= source-file of=destination-file  bs= blocksize
In your case it would go like this:
cd <directory containing iso>
Code: [Select]
dd bs=4M if=peppermint.iso of=/dev/sdg
/dev/sdg would be the destination USB device, change to suit your setup (make sure it is absolutely correct before commit)
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 26, 2014, 10:17:40 pm
Thanks Sezo, but with the greatest respect that may well have been written in a foreign language, sorry but I am just not that savvy as to understand what you mean at all, I get that the method needs to be used with great care but the actual procedure would have to be spelled out to me in words of one syllable or similar.


Cheers,
Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Emegra on June 26, 2014, 10:34:33 pm
Ok I'll try to help till SeZo gets back

first you will have to know the drive name of the USB drive you want to install Peppermint on ie sdg, sdf etc you can find out by plugging in the drive and go to Menu-Accessories-Disks when you see your usb drive highlight it see screenshot, in my case the 16gb Kingston is /dev/sdf

then post back with the usb drive name and the location and filename of the .iso you want to copy



Graeme
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Mark Greaves (PCNetSpec) on June 26, 2014, 10:41:16 pm
run:
Code: [Select]
sudo updatedb
then with the USB stick inserted, post the output from:
Code: [Select]
sudo fdisk -l
and
Code: [Select]
locate Peppermint-5-20140623
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: chemicalfan on June 27, 2014, 08:49:12 am
I'm guessing the self-build machine is too old to boot from USB (USB sticks came before the BIOS could use them to boot from)

If it's that old, I'm thinking this is a PAE issue or something similar. My guess is that Ubuntu 14.04's kernel isn't happy on such an old CPU, and Peppermint's is compiled in a more "old hardware friendly" way? If this is true, you're kinda out of luck OP :(
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Mark Greaves (PCNetSpec) on June 27, 2014, 09:31:52 am
I thought the Semperon 140 was 64bit ?

Have you tried booting a Peppermint 4 or 5 LiveCD/LiveUSB ? .. did it work ?

Have you tried the 64bit version ?
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 27, 2014, 10:26:40 am
Hi Mark,
Here is an update to the situation, I have booted Peppermint 5 64 bit Live CD to this Desktop and it runs fine, the 32 bit Ubuntu 14.04 also runs fine on my Peppermint Laptop. I also have a disc for Ubuntu 13.10 that I got with a book that I purchased and that also boots fine from the live DVD, it is just the 14.04 that doesnt boot. I will download the 64 bit version of 14.04 and then burn that and see if that boots ok.

Many thanks for your help as always, will get back to you when I have tried the 64 bit version.
Either way it is no big deal as 12.04 has 3 more years and Peppermint 5 will run fine so I am covered either way.


Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 27, 2014, 11:56:36 am
Hi Mark,
Well tried the 64 bit but unfortunately same result, it boots to the Try Ubuntu screen, click on that and sometimes it boots and then freezes, i.e. the mouse does not work and there is nothing from the keyboard and sometimes it just goes to a blank screen.

Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: chemicalfan on June 27, 2014, 12:56:16 pm
What graphics card do you have? This could be a "nomodeset" job
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 27, 2014, 01:50:22 pm
This is the output from these commands:derek@derek-System-Product-Name:~$ lspci | grep VGA
00:0d.0 VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation C61 [GeForce 7025 / nForce 630a] (rev a2)
derek@derek-System-Product-Name:~$ sudo lshw -C video
[sudo] password for derek:
  *-display               
       description: VGA compatible controller
       product: C61 [GeForce 7025 / nForce 630a]
       vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
       physical id: d
       bus info: pci@0000:00:0d.0
       version: a2
       width: 64 bits
       clock: 66MHz
       capabilities: pm msi vga_controller bus_master cap_list rom
       configuration: driver=nouveau latency=0
       resources: irq:22 memory:de000000-deffffff memory:c0000000-cfffffff memory:dd000000-ddffffff memory:dffc0000-dffdffff
Hope this is helpful.

Many thanks for your help and interest, it is much appreciated.


Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Mark Greaves (PCNetSpec) on June 27, 2014, 03:12:19 pm
So Peppermint 5 works on this machine, but Ubuntu 14.04 doesn't ?
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 27, 2014, 05:33:05 pm
Hi Mark,
Yes that is correct and why I titled the thread, "Odd Happening".  The Desktop runs 12.04 fine, has booted to a live 13.10 DVD and boots to  live Peppermint 5 CD without problem, but the 14.04 just keeps freezing or ending in a blank screen, have tried 32 bit and 64 bit versions and 2 different types of DVD.
Really odd to me, but then I dont know that much.

Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: SeZo on June 28, 2014, 07:48:29 pm
chemicalfan could be right.
You could try to boot it with the nomodeset parameter.

You can do that by hitting left shift key when boot starts and selecting f6 key.
Then from the menu presented select nomodeset. Then hit esc and enter.
See if that boots OK
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 28, 2014, 09:06:08 pm
Thank you all for your help
@sezo, tried what you suggested, boots to the opening screen but then the mouse will not operate and there is no response from the keyboard, whatever I press.
Any further thoughts?

Cheers,
Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: SeZo on June 28, 2014, 09:41:13 pm
What do you mean by "the opening screen", is that the desktop?
Did you select the try or install option?
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 28, 2014, 09:46:12 pm
Yes I mean the desktop, and yes it was the try option. ONce on the desktop the cursor just sits there and will not respond to mouse movement and no response from the keyboard whatever keys are pressed.
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: SeZo on June 28, 2014, 10:02:09 pm
OK It is definitely a graphics problem.
Try Safe graphics mode:

Press F6 to open the other options menu.
This opens this new menu … then close it!
At this point the command options show up near the bottom of the screen. Press tab to access these options.
Press space one (to make some space) and enter:     –xforcevesa
Press enter to boot
The resulting display will not be pretty, but should be functional
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 28, 2014, 10:06:49 pm
Thanks Sezo, will give that a go tomorrow.
I just don't understand why it boots Peppermint 5 no problem and even Ubuntu 13.10 but then falls down with 14.04, I thought Peppermint 5 was based on 14.04
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Mark Greaves (PCNetSpec) on June 29, 2014, 01:01:57 am
Quote
I thought Peppermint 5 was based on 14.04

it is :)

So it has to be a problem with something we've ripped out .. iBus maybe ? .. we've got our own Peppermint control center that sets mouse/keyboard settings now .. half prompted because iBus was all over the place (buggy as hell).

Is there any way to get to a command prompt ?

maybe booting safe mode .. or Ctrl+Alt+F1 from the login screen/or desktop ?
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 29, 2014, 02:43:35 pm
Hi Guys,
This is the latest update, tried your suggestion Sezo about adding -xforcevesa and this seems to have worked as I am replying from within Ubuntu 14.04 on the self build laptop. The first time I tried it the system went through a series of checks said everything was alright and then asked me to reboot, this I did but of course it then booted to 12.04 as per the hard drive. Repeated the exercise and this time it worked, a very plain screen with just the words Ubuntu 14.04 and four dots underneath, then eventually the normal  desktop screen came up.
So now I am in a bit of a quandary, what is the next step, I now know I can boot to a live session, if I install from this stage will I have to make changes to the boot up procedure or will it just work? Your further help and advice would be appreciated.
As indicated earlier this is just something I have to decide as I could just go to Peppermint 5 on this desktop if need be, but I would rather like to keep Ubuntu on here.
Comments please Gents,

Once again thanks,
Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Mark Greaves (PCNetSpec) on June 29, 2014, 03:19:44 pm
From the "Live" session, can you post the output from:
Code: [Select]
sudo lshw -C display
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 29, 2014, 03:28:31 pm
Hi Mark, as requested
ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo lshw -C display
  *-display UNCLAIMED     
       description: VGA compatible controller
       product: C61 [GeForce 7025 / nForce 630a]
       vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
       physical id: d
       bus info: pci@0000:00:0d.0
       version: a2
       width: 64 bits
       clock: 66MHz
       capabilities: pm msi vga_controller bus_master cap_list
       configuration: latency=0
       resources: memory:de000000-deffffff memory:c0000000-cfffffff memory:dd000000-ddffffff memory:dffc0000-dffdffff
ubuntu@ubuntu:~$
 Degsy
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Mark Greaves (PCNetSpec) on June 29, 2014, 03:43:12 pm
OK, after installation you may need to change the kernel boot line again to get booted .. then I'd expect you to be offered some proprietary graphics drivers for installation .. accept them, and hopefully that'll fix you up :)

If not, go to Software & Updates > Additional Drivers (tab), and that should offer you the proprietary driver(s).
Title: Re: Odd happening
Post by: Degsy on June 29, 2014, 03:54:36 pm
Ok Mark, thank you.  I will ensure that all my data is backed up and then during the course of the next few days will go ahead and install 14.04, if I then need further advice I will get back to you all.
Many thanks to Mark, Sezo and Chemicalfan for all your input, also anybody else that I may have missed out.


Regards,
Derek
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