The problem with Linux

If you introduce a Windows user to Linux and something doesn’t work just right then Linux is the problem, people very quickly forget they had problems with Windows as well, the difference is when they had issues with Windows it wasn’t really Windows fault it was the computer, It’s just how computers are, what they really needed was a new computer that would solve everything but they never think that way when they’re using Linux.

This is the major disadvantage Linux operates under as an alternative desktop operating system because Windows is the defacto operating system that everything must be compared to (as imperfect as it is) but human nature being as it is means that any failure in Linux (which is also imperfect) is a fault with Linux and any failure in Windows is a fault with the computer because that’s just how computers are

an example would be my missus who loves the speed of her Peppermint OS in general but gets frustrated with Peppermint (not her computer) when the odd you tube video buffers or won’t play at all like it always did with with Windows (apparently). how quickly she forgets the misery her Windows PC put her through before migrating to Linux in the first place

Old habits die hard but the way I see it is that Windows is not the enemy to Linux adoption (if it was Linux would have blown it out the water years ago) it’s the blind fools who use it and get out their credit/debit cards the minute it fails them

Couldn’t agree more … I’ve watched people switch back to Windows at the first problem … completely ignoring the fact that Windows gives them MORE problems.

Have you moved her to the Pepperflash plugin rather than the Adobe flashplayer ?
http://peppermintos.net/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=6176

I could have sworn I’d posted that tutorial here too … but I can’t find it :o

How true…

Only yesterday I got an SOS from a friend telling me his laptop would not boot.(Windows Vista).

On examination the HDD had died and he was all for going out to buy a new machine with Windows 8.

I persuaded him to buy a new external HDD and I loaded it with Peppermint 4 for him.

The laptop is flying along and he is delighted with it.

He had never heard of linux before…He has now. ;D

Jocklad

Have you moved her to the Pepperflash plugin rather than the Adobe flashplayer ?

I’m not sure but I’ll check it out tomorrow, to be fair she does some issues with you tube videos so hopefully we can sort it out for her

Graeme

This is what we lie to hear … remains to be seen if he’ll run for Windows cover at the first hiccup though :wink:

Erm yes, you mentioned that … kinda why I suggested it :slight_smile:

How much beer did you say you’d had ?

How much beer did you say you'd had ?

Don’t remember all I know is my brain hurts ;D

On examination the HDD had died and he was all for going out to buy a new machine with Windows 8.

Well done Jocklad sounds like you saved him from a fate worse than death meantime

Can I as why did you suggested an external HDD and not an internal HDD ?

Graeme

thanks for that post Emegra…its a good calm down post.
I installed Mint 15 on my lenovo X60 with only minor difficulties - difficulty which became impossibility of reading files on my desktop upstairs
Yesterday I did the same (dualboot) on my desktop which comes from various sources - built it myself. And it really has been a descent into hell…

  • No sound, later poor sound from sound cards (works perfectly in windows)
  • Inability to network with a laptop running the same OS
  • Scanner doesn’t work (Although printer does)
  • Software manager keeps crashing
  • inferior connectivity with Android smartphones
    Your right that we forget windows headaches, and I’ll keep trying with mint, i really want to break the microsoft addiction, but I do think some of the Linux community should take a look at the things that windows does well and learn the lesson - I saw on the mint forum that people have been discussing a network connection wizard for several years now. Most users will not be hobbysts but people who want to do something and my (OK very limited) experience is that things need to improve quite a lot. I’ve worked in IT for a dozen years BTW so I’m not a complete fool, but I think a lot of new users will be totally shocked at how steep the learning curve actually is. Maybe they need to have their expectations managed in this respect….

It appears that you have had more than a fair share of the troubles with your install.
My experience is totally the opposite. I have been using Linux exclusively (at home) on diverse machines (old and new) since Ubuntu 6.06 came out without any major incident.
Perhaps I was fortunate in that all of my machines were Linux friendly. :smiley:
Even when I encountered some problems, they were all minor (or my own making) and could easily be solved with little googling.

The trouble is that you only hear from people with problems, the rest are either given up (and gone back to the OS they are used to) or silently enjoy the benefits from living in the Linux ecosystem.

What he said :slight_smile:
(Except for the 6.06 bit … I haven’t been on Linux quite that long … I’m more 9.10 vintage)

I think a lot of new users will be totally shocked at how steep the learning curve actually is. Maybe they need to have their expectations managed in this respect….

II think a lot of people might be shocked at how unsteep (there has to be a better word for that but it just wont come to me) the learning curve is

I admit there is a learning curve with Linux and it can be frustrating at times especially for new users but to be fair your example is not a typical one and I’m sure these issues your having is quite sortable with a bit of help

Linux does have certain weaknesses over Windows and the biggest one is lack of driver support from hardware manufacturers but that doesn’t make Linux an inferior operating system it just makes it disadvantaged but I think the community do an amazing job of redressing that disadvantage and providing us users with drivers and software that makes using Linux the rewarding experience it can be.

User friendliness is a very relative term and can be very easily mistaken for just being different, old habits die hard and many people (such as myself) come to Linux after possibly 20+ years of doing things the Windows way, and so we look at Linux problems from a Windows perspective which can sometimes make a simple problem more complicated than it has to be.

For me Linux is a kind of love/hate thing where there is so much i love about Linux yet there are some things that just frustrate the hell out of me, but the advantages far outweigh the disadvantages and never forget when you use Linux on your PC or laptop it’s your operating system, you own it and you are free to do as you wish with it,

As Linux users we are the minority so we don’t get the same support from hardware manufacturers Windows users enjoy so we have to rely on the community and each other for help and support so my advice would be stick with it and if you’re having issues post them here and I’m sure you’ll get all the help you need.

Graeme

I believe the issue is one of perception.

“Windows is easy because it works straight away” versus “Linux is hard because you have to install it and mess about to get it working”

In the non-technical computing world, your average user (ie most of us - worldwide) has never had to install Windows from scratch because we buy OEM versions! We never see the hoops that have to be jumped through to get it working correctly because a tech in a factory somewhere has done it for us! And that tech is not interested in giving us the lowdown because he knows a whole industry has been built on us not knowing! If things go wrong, Mr Average hasn’t got a clue how to fix it so has to rely on support (cost) or upgrade (even greater cost).

With Linux, Mr Average now has a disk in his hand - possibly for the first time ever. If he hits a snag, it’s because “Linux is cp" and won’t load/ do what he expects. It never crosses his mind that Windows is probably "cppier” and is even harder to install…! He has nothing to compare it with, all he feels is frustration that this so-called o/s won’t do what he wants. If he just raises his eyes, uses our old friend ‘google’ he’ll see that there is (literally) a world of help out there populated by people who will help, just because they can and with no other motive than that. (Windows forums users are wonderful too, it’s just that they work with one hand tied behind their backs - they don’t have access to the code)

I choose Linux because I like to have control. Simple as that. The fact that I save (a lot!) of money, have far fewer computing headaches, can decide where, when and how I use my system and not to be driven down a route I have no wish to take is merely a happy by-product.

I run Mint 13KDE at the moment and am more than happy with it. I’m no expert, just Mr Average. But what my Linux experience has done for me has got me interested in a fascinating subject that I’m keen to explore. A lightbulb moment!

Best wishes to everyone on this excellent forum - keep up the good work. :wink:

Rich

@Emegra
Could that word be flat ?

take care
Don W
:smiley:

EDIT Spelling

Well I am not an IT geek and know little abut operating systems, but have found Linux pretty easy to use with help from here. I mean, I was bought a Dell netbook preloaded with Ubuntu 2 years ago in cash converter’s as a gift from my mother as my stupid old Windows desktop had died- what a gift this was! Right from the start I was able to figure out how to create documents and navigate around the applications for day to day computer usage. I found it much more logical than Windows. My local Linux group guys loaded Mint onto it for me.

Then I inherited my late brother’s old XP laptop which Mark helped me load Peppermint on. Any “problems” I may have had with my computers have been very minor and more to do with needing more RAM ( this laptop) or not knowing how to do something. Windows caused me constant headaches.

Also, old stuff that won’t work on Windows anymore works on Linux! My friend gave me an old scanner that was designed for XP that won’t work on her computers, yet Mark got this working brilliantly on my Peppermint laptop! It is great having a scanner!

I thought I would update my earlier post.
It turns out that every single issue I had with Mint Linux 16 was due to one really horrible bug which led to incomplete packages being installed.
Other have had it and you can follow it at Bug #1197995 “Wrong sources in official-package-repositories.lis...” : Bugs : Linux Mint.
Once fixed, everything fell into place.
I’m glad I persevered - the system now seems rock solid, all peripherals installed correctly, networking works fine too, email profiles correctly imported.
Very glad I persevered

Cheers waynea … that little bit of info may come in handy.

Anyone suffering weird problems with Mint I’ll be sure to get them to check the release name in the ubuntu repo lines in their sources.list

You’d think Mint would sort this if it’s been happening to people over two Mint releases now :o

@ waynea

Glad you’re perseverance paid off unfortunately perseverance such as yours is a rare quality these days all too many people try Linux come across a problem they can’t figure out in 5 minutes and rather persevere as you did or look for help, they give up and go back to the virus, spyware, malware ridden hell that is Windows and tell the world that Linux is crap

Graeme

I’ve got Mint on my netbook and it is awesome- never had a problem with it at all.